We having been working on drafting a policy with SNS whilst we have been out there. It will be based on usage data but there are some caveats I believe. Rob was working in the group looking at the usage data. Rob - what was the outcome of that session? From: Manuel, Pascal (STFC,RAL,ISIS) &lt;pascal.manuel(a)stfc.ac.uk&gt; Sent: 18 October 2023 23:40 To: Foxley, Sarah (STFC,RAL,ISIS) &lt;sarah.foxley(a)stfc.ac.uk&gt;uk>; mpb(a)mantidproject.org Subject: Re: Communicating with Mantid Users I would say that almost nobody reads the announcement emails, forum, release notes.... How is the decision made to depreciate algorithms in the first place? My recollection is that we were capturing the usage, is it based on that? ________________________________ From: Sarah Foxley - STFC UKRI <sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk<mailto:sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk>> Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2023 3:34 PM To: mpb@mantidproject.org<mailto:mpb@mantidproject.org> <mpb@mantidproject.org<mailto:mpb@mantidproject.org>> Subject: [Mpb] Communicating with Mantid Users Dear all, Several of us are currently attending the Mantid Developer meeting at SNS. One of the things that has come up is deprecating algorithms that are no longer in use. The first step is to put together a policy for how we do it. This will include things like steps to take to ensure an algorithm is suitable for deprecation and how long we leave between initial deprecation notice and removal. It strikes me that I don't feel I have an adequate grasp of how we are communicating with our users at ISIS. As far as I'm aware we have the announcements e-mail list (but not sure who looks at these e-mails), the forum (which is rarely used) and sub team leads meeting/e-mailing their contacts. I also know information like deprecations are in the release notes/help but are people seeing this and are these methods a little late in the process? I'm wondering if there are other informal ways we've been communicating? Are there better ways we could get news out? Rather than trying to discuss this via e-mail is this something we can discuss at our MPB meeting on 22nd November? Thanks Sarah Sarah Foxley Scientific Software Engineer & Mantid Project Manager Science and Technology Facilities Council Phone - 01235 446938 sarah.foxley@stfc.ukri.org<mailto:sarah.foxley@stfc.ukri.org> She/Her/Hers [stfc_logo]

Hi Sarah, There were a couple of caveats with regards to the completeness of the usage statistics. In particular, it is possible for users to opt-out of sending usage statistics, so we may not get a full picture of everything which is used. There seems to be two broad themes why people might want to opt-out: 1. They want to keep privacy. However, it's worth noting the usage statistics we collect are completely anonymous and contain no personal data. It's essentially just an increment to the particular feature that was used. We should then ask, why give the option to opt-out? 2. They are concerned reporting usage will cause a slowdown in their workflow (as it sends a usage report each time an algorithm is executed). At SNS, they turn off usage statistics by default for this reason. A potential solution would be to only report usage statistics upon exiting Mantid, so usage statistics are only sent once per Mantid session. If we can address these two issues, I think the statistics from the usage service would work really well for our algorithm deprecation policy. The statistics from the usage service would also perhaps be a really useful way to quantify what is used/isn't used at our MPB meetings. Kind Regards, Rob From: Stephen King - STFC UKRI &lt;stephen.king(a)stfc.ac.uk&gt; Sent: Friday, October 20, 2023 5:02 PM To: Foxley, Sarah (STFC,RAL,ISIS) &lt;sarah.foxley(a)stfc.ac.uk&gt; Cc: mpb(a)mantidproject.org Subject: [Mpb] Re: Communicating with Mantid Users To your list of present communication routes, Sarah, I would add the Science Advisory Forum. Other fora that might be considered are the IDG Meeting (hits a cross-section of inst scientists), the Neutron Users Meeting (hits a subset of UK users), and an additional popup window when you first run a new version (hits all users) saying 'The following algorithms are deprecated in this release and are due to be removed in vx.x.x. If you have any concerns please contact...'? Steve From: Sarah Foxley - STFC UKRI <sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk<mailto:sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk>> Sent: 20 October 2023 14:51 To: Manuel, Pascal (STFC,RAL,ISIS) <pascal.manuel@stfc.ac.uk<mailto:pascal.manuel@stfc.ac.uk>>; mpb@mantidproject.org<mailto:mpb@mantidproject.org> Subject: [Mpb] Re: Communicating with Mantid Users We having been working on drafting a policy with SNS whilst we have been out there. It will be based on usage data but there are some caveats I believe. Rob was working in the group looking at the usage data. Rob - what was the outcome of that session? From: Manuel, Pascal (STFC,RAL,ISIS) <pascal.manuel@stfc.ac.uk<mailto:pascal.manuel@stfc.ac.uk>> Sent: 18 October 2023 23:40 To: Foxley, Sarah (STFC,RAL,ISIS) <sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk<mailto:sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk>>; mpb@mantidproject.org<mailto:mpb@mantidproject.org> Subject: Re: Communicating with Mantid Users I would say that almost nobody reads the announcement emails, forum, release notes.... How is the decision made to depreciate algorithms in the first place? My recollection is that we were capturing the usage, is it based on that? ________________________________ From: Sarah Foxley - STFC UKRI <sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk<mailto:sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk>> Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2023 3:34 PM To: mpb@mantidproject.org<mailto:mpb@mantidproject.org> <mpb@mantidproject.org<mailto:mpb@mantidproject.org>> Subject: [Mpb] Communicating with Mantid Users Dear all, Several of us are currently attending the Mantid Developer meeting at SNS. One of the things that has come up is deprecating algorithms that are no longer in use. The first step is to put together a policy for how we do it. This will include things like steps to take to ensure an algorithm is suitable for deprecation and how long we leave between initial deprecation notice and removal. It strikes me that I don't feel I have an adequate grasp of how we are communicating with our users at ISIS. As far as I'm aware we have the announcements e-mail list (but not sure who looks at these e-mails), the forum (which is rarely used) and sub team leads meeting/e-mailing their contacts. I also know information like deprecations are in the release notes/help but are people seeing this and are these methods a little late in the process? I'm wondering if there are other informal ways we've been communicating? Are there better ways we could get news out? Rather than trying to discuss this via e-mail is this something we can discuss at our MPB meeting on 22nd November? Thanks Sarah Sarah Foxley Scientific Software Engineer & Mantid Project Manager Science and Technology Facilities Council Phone - 01235 446938 sarah.foxley@stfc.ukri.org<mailto:sarah.foxley@stfc.ukri.org> She/Her/Hers [stfc_logo]

Hi Steve, Yes, the usage counter is incremented every time an algorithm is executed. If an algorithm is called X times in a loop, the usage is incremented X times. The usage of child algorithms (algorithms called by other algorithms) is indeed recorded. They are recorded with a field called 'internal' set to true, while the usage of parent algorithms are recorded with the 'internal' field set to false - so this allows us to distinguish how algorithms are being used. Thanks, Rob From: King, Stephen (STFC,RAL,ISIS) &lt;stephen.king(a)stfc.ac.uk&gt; Sent: Monday, October 23, 2023 10:49 AM To: Applin, Robert (STFC,RAL,ISIS) &lt;robert.applin(a)stfc.ac.uk&gt; Cc: mpb(a)mantidproject.org Subject: Re: Communicating with Mantid Users Hi Rob, When you say a usage report is sent every time an algorithm is called, do you mean that literally, as in if it's in a loop called X times the usage counter gets incremented X times? Or is the counter only incremented once for 1 pass through the workflow? And if you have an algorithm calling other algorithms, does only the calling algorithm get counted, or all of them? Just curious... Steve Sent from my iPhone 12 Mini ________________________________ From: Robert Applin - STFC UKRI <robert.applin@stfc.ac.uk<mailto:robert.applin@stfc.ac.uk>> Sent: Monday, October 23, 2023 10:28:20 AM To: Foxley, Sarah (STFC,RAL,ISIS) <sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk<mailto:sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk>> Cc: mpb@mantidproject.org<mailto:mpb@mantidproject.org> <mpb@mantidproject.org<mailto:mpb@mantidproject.org>> Subject: [Mpb] Re: Communicating with Mantid Users Hi Sarah, There were a couple of caveats with regards to the completeness of the usage statistics. In particular, it is possible for users to opt-out of sending usage statistics, so we may not get a full picture of everything which is used. There seems to be two broad themes why people might want to opt-out: 1. They want to keep privacy. However, it's worth noting the usage statistics we collect are completely anonymous and contain no personal data. It's essentially just an increment to the particular feature that was used. We should then ask, why give the option to opt-out? 2. They are concerned reporting usage will cause a slowdown in their workflow (as it sends a usage report each time an algorithm is executed). At SNS, they turn off usage statistics by default for this reason. A potential solution would be to only report usage statistics upon exiting Mantid, so usage statistics are only sent once per Mantid session. If we can address these two issues, I think the statistics from the usage service would work really well for our algorithm deprecation policy. The statistics from the usage service would also perhaps be a really useful way to quantify what is used/isn't used at our MPB meetings. Kind Regards, Rob From: Stephen King - STFC UKRI <stephen.king@stfc.ac.uk<mailto:stephen.king@stfc.ac.uk>> Sent: Friday, October 20, 2023 5:02 PM To: Foxley, Sarah (STFC,RAL,ISIS) <sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk<mailto:sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk>> Cc: mpb@mantidproject.org<mailto:mpb@mantidproject.org> Subject: [Mpb] Re: Communicating with Mantid Users To your list of present communication routes, Sarah, I would add the Science Advisory Forum. Other fora that might be considered are the IDG Meeting (hits a cross-section of inst scientists), the Neutron Users Meeting (hits a subset of UK users), and an additional popup window when you first run a new version (hits all users) saying 'The following algorithms are deprecated in this release and are due to be removed in vx.x.x. If you have any concerns please contact...'? Steve From: Sarah Foxley - STFC UKRI <sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk<mailto:sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk>> Sent: 20 October 2023 14:51 To: Manuel, Pascal (STFC,RAL,ISIS) <pascal.manuel@stfc.ac.uk<mailto:pascal.manuel@stfc.ac.uk>>; mpb@mantidproject.org<mailto:mpb@mantidproject.org> Subject: [Mpb] Re: Communicating with Mantid Users We having been working on drafting a policy with SNS whilst we have been out there. It will be based on usage data but there are some caveats I believe. Rob was working in the group looking at the usage data. Rob - what was the outcome of that session? From: Manuel, Pascal (STFC,RAL,ISIS) <pascal.manuel@stfc.ac.uk<mailto:pascal.manuel@stfc.ac.uk>> Sent: 18 October 2023 23:40 To: Foxley, Sarah (STFC,RAL,ISIS) <sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk<mailto:sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk>>; mpb@mantidproject.org<mailto:mpb@mantidproject.org> Subject: Re: Communicating with Mantid Users I would say that almost nobody reads the announcement emails, forum, release notes.... How is the decision made to depreciate algorithms in the first place? My recollection is that we were capturing the usage, is it based on that? ________________________________ From: Sarah Foxley - STFC UKRI <sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk<mailto:sarah.foxley@stfc.ac.uk>> Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2023 3:34 PM To: mpb@mantidproject.org<mailto:mpb@mantidproject.org> <mpb@mantidproject.org<mailto:mpb@mantidproject.org>> Subject: [Mpb] Communicating with Mantid Users Dear all, Several of us are currently attending the Mantid Developer meeting at SNS. One of the things that has come up is deprecating algorithms that are no longer in use. The first step is to put together a policy for how we do it. This will include things like steps to take to ensure an algorithm is suitable for deprecation and how long we leave between initial deprecation notice and removal. It strikes me that I don't feel I have an adequate grasp of how we are communicating with our users at ISIS. As far as I'm aware we have the announcements e-mail list (but not sure who looks at these e-mails), the forum (which is rarely used) and sub team leads meeting/e-mailing their contacts. I also know information like deprecations are in the release notes/help but are people seeing this and are these methods a little late in the process? I'm wondering if there are other informal ways we've been communicating? Are there better ways we could get news out? Rather than trying to discuss this via e-mail is this something we can discuss at our MPB meeting on 22nd November? Thanks Sarah Sarah Foxley Scientific Software Engineer & Mantid Project Manager Science and Technology Facilities Council Phone - 01235 446938 sarah.foxley@stfc.ukri.org<mailto:sarah.foxley@stfc.ukri.org> She/Her/Hers [stfc_logo]